Creel Pone

Creel Pone

Profile:
Bootleg record label run by Keith Fullerton Whitman ( Broken-Music/ BrokenMusic) that "re-issues" early electroacoustic & experimental recordings in CDR fromat. Currently operating out of Melbourne, Australia, via KFW's Broken-Music distribution outlet (previoulsy Mimaroglu Music Sales). Each release is a limited facsimile edition (50 or 100 units) with a silver foil-stamp on the crystal-clear resealable polypropylene compact-disc sleeve. Originally the label was run by Fullerton Whitman using the pseudonym Pieter Christophssen aka Mr. P.C./C.P (also associated with DJ Hekla through an email address) with a claim that it was based in Iceland. He now openly admits his involvement in the bootlegging venture
Sites:
[l44976]

Label


Cat#  Artist Title (Format) Label Cat#  Country Year
001 Pieces For Kohn  album cover Thomas Hamilton* Pieces For Kohn(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 001 US 2005 Sell This Version
002 Mise En Musique Du Corticalart De Roger Lafosse  album cover Pierre Henry Mise En Musique Du Corticalart De Roger Lafosse(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 002 US 2005 Sell This Version
003 Magyar Elektronikus Zene: Hungarian Electronic Music  album cover Various Magyar Elektronikus Zene: Hungarian Electronic Music(CD, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 003 US 2005 Sell This Version
004 Epitaph Für Aikichi Kuboyama  album cover Herbert Eimert Epitaph Für Aikichi Kuboyama(CDr, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 004 US 2005 Sell This Version
005 Conrad & Sohn  album cover Conrad Schnitzler & Gregor Schnitzler Conrad Schnitzler & Gregor Schnitzler - Conrad & Sohn(CDr, Album, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 005 US 2005 Sell This Version
006 L's GA - Ballad - Octet  album cover Salvatore Martirano L's GA - Ballad - Octet(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 006 US 2005 Sell This Version
007 Electronic Music  album cover Bent Lorentzen Electronic Music (Album) 007 US 2005 Sell This Version
008 Électronique Et Stéréophonie: Musique Spatiale  album cover Oskar Sala / Harald Genzmer Oskar Sala / Harald Genzmer - Électronique Et Stéréophonie: Musique Spatiale(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 008 US 2005 Sell This Version
009 Elektronische Musik  album cover Reinhold Weber (2) Elektronische Musik 009 US 2005 Sell This Version
010 Anthology Of Dutch Electronic Tape Music: Volume 1 (1955-1966)  album cover Various Anthology Of Dutch Electronic Tape Music: Volume 1 (1955-1966)(2xCDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 010 US 2005 Sell This Version
012 Recorded Music For Film, Radio & Television: Electronic Vol. 1  album cover Tod Dockstader Recorded Music For Film, Radio & Television: Electronic Vol. 1(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 012 US 2005 Sell This Version
013 Electronic Music  album cover Vaclav Nelhybel Electronic Music(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 013 US 2005 Sell This Version
014 Carrefour (Musique Electro-Acoustique / Electroacoustic Music - Canada)  album cover Various Carrefour (Musique Electro-Acoustique / Electroacoustic Music - Canada)(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 014 US 2005 Sell This Version
015 Independent Electronic Music Composer  album cover Edward M. Zajda Independent Electronic Music Composer(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 015 US 2005 Sell This Version
016 Insight Modulation  album cover Zanagoria Insight Modulation(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 016 US 2005 Sell This Version
017 Iowa Ear Music  album cover Various Iowa Ear Music(CDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone 017 US 2005 Sell This Version
018 The Inside Of The Outside / Or The Outside Of The Inside - Who Are They? Where Do They Come From? Why Are They Here?  album cover George Engler The Inside Of The Outside / Or The Outside Of The Inside - Who Are They? Where Do They Come From? Why Are They Here?(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 018 US 2005 Sell This Version
019 Le Crabe Qui Jouait Avec La Mer  album cover Philippe Arthuys Le Crabe Qui Jouait Avec La Mer(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 019 US 2005 Sell This Version
020 Anthology Of Dutch Electronic Tape Music: Volume 2 (1966-1977)  album cover Various Anthology Of Dutch Electronic Tape Music: Volume 2 (1966-1977)(2xCDr, Comp, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 020 US 2005 Sell This Version
022 Reflecting On The First Watch, We Uncover Treasure Buried For The Blind  album cover Cellutron & The Invisible Reflecting On The First Watch, We Uncover Treasure Buried For The Blind(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 022 US 2005 Sell This Version
023 Josef Anton Riedl  album cover Josef Anton Riedl Josef Anton Riedl(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 023 US 2005 Sell This Version
024 Totentanz  album cover Warren Jepson* Totentanz(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 024 US 2005 Sell This Version
025 Roots Of Electronic Sound  album cover Matsuo Ono* w/ Takehisa Kosugi Matsuo Ono* w/ Takehisa Kosugi - Roots Of Electronic Sound(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 025 US 2005 Sell This Version
026 Parmak Çocuk  album cover Solmaz Sporel & Ilhan Mimaroglu Solmaz Sporel & Ilhan Mimaroglu - Parmak Çocuk(CDr, EP, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 026 US 2005 Sell This Version
027 After Guernica  album cover Morris Knight After Guernica(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 027 US 2006 Sell This Version
028 The Andromeda Strain: Original Electronic Soundtrack  album cover Gil Mellé The Andromeda Strain: Original Electronic Soundtrack(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 028 US 2006 Sell This Version
029 Urvarte - Noir - Blau (Electronic Music)  album cover Svend Christiansen (2) & Fuzzy (4) Svend Christiansen (2) & Fuzzy (4) - Urvarte - Noir - Blau (Electronic Music)(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 029 US 2006 Sell This Version
030 Shànti  album cover Jean-Claude Eloy Shànti(2xCDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 030 US 2006 Sell This Version
032 Estórias Para Voz, Instrumentos Acústicos e Eletrônicos  album cover Jocy de Oliveira Estórias Para Voz, Instrumentos Acústicos e Eletrônicos(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 032 US 2006 Sell This Version
033 Cortical Art III  album cover Pierre Henry Cortical Art III(CDr, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 033 US 2006 Sell This Version
034 Greek Electronic Music - 1  album cover Various Greek Electronic Music - 1(CDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone 034 US 2006 Sell This Version
035 We (Nosotros)  album cover Luis De Pablo We (Nosotros) (Album) 035 US 2006 Sell This Version
036 Symphonie Rouge / Symphonie Jaune  album cover Paul Boisselet Symphonie Rouge / Symphonie Jaune(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 036 US 2006 Sell This Version
037 "Hör!-spiel" / Nekrologlog 1961 / Fantasmata 1960  album cover Anestis Logothetis "Hör!-spiel" / Nekrologlog 1961 / Fantasmata 1960(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 037 US 2006 Sell This Version
038 Dub Taylor (3) Lumière For Synthesized & Concrète Sound(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 038 US 2006 Sell This Version
039 Electronic Music: Experimental Studios In Prague, Bratislava, Munich, University Of Illinois, Warsaw, Paris  album cover Various Electronic Music: Experimental Studios In Prague, Bratislava, Munich, University Of Illinois, Warsaw, Paris(CDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone 039 Iceland 2006 Sell This Version
040 Computer Music  album cover Pietro Grossi Computer Music(2xCDr, RE, Unofficial + CDr, Mini, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone, Creel Pone 040 US 2006 Sell This Version
043 Cosmographie  album cover Bruno Menny Cosmographie(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 043 US 2006 Sell This Version
044 Electronic Music University Of Melbourne  album cover Various Electronic Music University Of Melbourne(CDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone 044 US 2006 Sell This Version
045 Reality Gates  album cover Steve Birchall Reality Gates(CDr, Comp, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 045 US 2006 Sell This Version
046 Human Music  album cover Jon Appleton & Don Cherry Jon Appleton & Don Cherry - Human Music(CDr, Album, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 046 US 2006 Sell This Version
047 Flowers Of Evil  album cover Ruth White Flowers Of Evil(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 047 US 2006 Sell This Version
048 Pythagoron Inc.  album cover Pythagoron™ Pythagoron Inc.(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 048 US 2006 Sell This Version
049 Bernard Bonnier Casse-tête(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 049 US 2006 Sell This Version
050 New Zealand Electronic Music  album cover Various New Zealand Electronic Music(2xCDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 050 US 2006 Sell This Version
052 La Jolla Good Friday I-II  album cover Thorkell Sigurbjörnsson* La Jolla Good Friday I-II(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 052 US 2006 Sell This Version
053  Elektronische Produktie Van I.P.E.M.  album cover Various Elektronische Produktie Van I.P.E.M.(CDr, Comp, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 053 US 2006 Sell This Version
054 Elektronische Mythen  album cover Jürgen Karg Elektronische Mythen 054 US 2006 Sell This Version
055 Musique Pour Le Futur  album cover Nino Nardini Musique Pour Le Futur(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 055 US 2006 Sell This Version
056 Creelpolation  album cover Various Creelpolation(3xCDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone, Creel Pone 056 US 2006 Sell This Version
059 Sozialistische Musiker Initiative  album cover Max E. Keller / Martin Schwarzenlander Max E. Keller / Martin Schwarzenlander - Sozialistische Musiker Initiative(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 059 US 2006 Sell This Version
060 Musiques De L'O.N.F. / Music Of The N.F.B.: Volume 1  album cover Various Musiques De L'O.N.F. / Music Of The N.F.B.: Volume 1(2xCDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 060 US 2006 Sell This Version
062 Recorded Music For Film, Radio & Television: Electronic Vol. 2  album cover Tod Dockstader Recorded Music For Film, Radio & Television: Electronic Vol. 2(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 062 US 2006 Sell This Version
063 Blanche Neige: Suite Musicale En 14 Tableaux De Jacques Lejeune Pour Dire Le Conte Et Danser Avec Les Enfants  album cover Jacques Lejeune Blanche Neige: Suite Musicale En 14 Tableaux De Jacques Lejeune Pour Dire Le Conte Et Danser Avec Les Enfants(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 063 US 2006 Sell This Version
064 Iatrogenics  album cover The Electronic Music Club Of Edmonds Community College Iatrogenics(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 064 US 2006 Sell This Version
065 Musikautomatika  album cover Musikautomatika Musikautomatika(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 065 US 2006 Sell This Version
066 Impact Synthesized Sound And Music  album cover H. Tical Impact Synthesized Sound And Music(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 066 US 2006 Sell This Version
067 Musiques Expérimentales  album cover Almuro* Musiques Expérimentales(CDr, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 067 US 2007 Sell This Version
068 Musica Electroacustica  album cover Various Musica Electroacustica(CDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone 068 US 2007 Sell This Version
069 No Imagination  album cover Gregory Jones (3) & Roy Sablosky Gregory Jones (3) & Roy Sablosky - No Imagination(CDr, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 069 US 2007 Sell This Version
070 Gaku-No-Michi (Les Voies De La Musique)  album cover Jean-Claude Eloy Gaku-No-Michi (Les Voies De La Musique)(2xCDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 070 US 2007 Sell This Version
072 7 Trumps From The Tarot Cards And Pinions  album cover Ruth White 7 Trumps From The Tarot Cards And Pinions(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 072 US 2007 Sell This Version
073 Lettre À Une Demoiselle  album cover Christian Clozier / Jacques Lejeune Christian Clozier / Jacques Lejeune - Lettre À Une Demoiselle(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 073 US 2007 Sell This Version
074 Spectacular Stereo Sounds  album cover Cecil Leuter Spectacular Stereo Sounds(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 074 US 2007 Sell This Version
075 The Pulses Of Time  album cover Denis Smalley The Pulses Of Time(CDr, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 075 US 2007 Sell This Version
076 From Czech Electronic Music Studios  album cover Various From Czech Electronic Music Studios(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 076 US 2007 Sell This Version
077 Provocative Electronics (Electronic Constructions On Traditional Forms)  album cover Emerson Meyers Provocative Electronics (Electronic Constructions On Traditional Forms)(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 077 US 2007 Sell This Version
078 Luna Cinese  album cover Costin Miereanu Luna Cinese(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 078 US 2007 Sell This Version
079 Music To Freak Your Friends And Break Your Lease  album cover Heins Hoffman-Richter Music To Freak Your Friends And Break Your Lease(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 079 US 2007 Sell This Version
080 The Complete Narco Records & Tapes Recordings  album cover Nik Pascal The Complete Narco Records & Tapes Recordings(2xCDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 080 US 2007 Sell This Version
082 Electronomusic — 9 Images  album cover John Pfeiffer Electronomusic — 9 Images(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 082 US 2007 Sell This Version
083 Journey To The Land Of Forgotten Dreams  album cover Lorq Damon Journey To The Land Of Forgotten Dreams(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 083 US 2007 Sell This Version
084 Hommage À Bartók  album cover Nicolas Schöffer Hommage À Bartók(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE) Creel Pone 084 US 2007 Sell This Version
085 I.P.E.M.  album cover Lucien Goethals / Louis De Meester Lucien Goethals / Louis De Meester - I.P.E.M.(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 085 US 2008 Sell This Version
086 "A2" / Oscillations Nos. 1-3  album cover László Dubrovay "A2" / Oscillations Nos. 1-3(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 086 US 2008 Sell This Version
087 Klangbilder  album cover Günter Maas Klangbilder(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone 087 US 2008 Sell This Version
088 Musique Numérique  album cover Daniel Arfib Musique Numérique(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 088 US 2008 Sell This Version
089 Íslensk Raftónlist / Electronic Music From Iceland  album cover Lárus Halldór Grímsson / Thorsteinn Hauksson Lárus Halldór Grímsson / Thorsteinn Hauksson - Íslensk Raftónlist / Electronic Music From Iceland(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 089 US 2008 Sell This Version
090 Entropical Paradise  album cover Douglas Leedy Entropical Paradise(2xCDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 090 US 2008 Sell This Version
092 Michael Sahl Tropes On The Salve Regina(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 092 US 2008 Sell This Version
093 Musique Barbare  album cover Karel Appel Musique Barbare(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 093 US 2009 Sell This Version
094 Música Electroacústica Mexicana  album cover Various Música Electroacústica Mexicana(CDr, Comp, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 094 US 2009 Sell This Version
095 A Arte Dos Sons  album cover Rodolfo Caesar A Arte Dos Sons(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 095 US 2009 Sell This Version
096 Elettroformule  album cover Giuliano Sorgini Elettroformule(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 096 US 2009 Sell This Version
097 L' Envol / Ambitus  album cover André Almuro L' Envol / Ambitus(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 097 US 2009 Sell This Version
098 People The Sky  album cover Michael Czajkowski People The Sky(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 098 US 2009 Sell This Version
099 Elektronische + Phonetische Kompositionen  album cover Reinhold Weber (2) Elektronische + Phonetische Kompositionen(CDr, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 099 US 2009 Sell This Version
100 Images / Ambiances  album cover Knud Viktor Images / Ambiances(2xCDr, Comp, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 100 US 2009 Sell This Version
102 Le Robot  album cover Paul Boisselet Le Robot(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 102 US 2009 Sell This Version
103 Luxikon II / Echospace  album cover Gil Trythall Luxikon II / Echospace(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 103 US 2009 Sell This Version
104 Espaces Sonores No. 1  album cover Parmegiani* / Mestres Quadreny* Parmegiani* / Mestres Quadreny* - Espaces Sonores No. 1(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 104 US 2009 Sell This Version
105 Music To Wash Dishes By  album cover Tom Cameron (2) Music To Wash Dishes By(CDr, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 105 US 2010 Sell This Version
106 Sondern Die Sterne Sinds  album cover Klaus Ager Sondern Die Sterne Sinds(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 106 US 2010 Sell This Version
107 Włodzimierz Kotoński Electronic And Instrumental Music(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 107 US 2010 Sell This Version
108 Ze Wörmnest  album cover Jonas Palm Ze Wörmnest(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 108 US 2010 Sell This Version
109 Musica Elettronica 1  album cover Romolo Grano Musica Elettronica 1(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 109 US 2010 Sell This Version
110 The Complete Badger Recordings  album cover Chris Swansen The Complete Badger Recordings(CDr, Unofficial) Creel Pone, Creel Pone 110 US 2010 Sell This Version
111 Audiopoems  album cover Henri Chopin Audiopoems(CDr, Album, Unofficial) Creel Pone 111 US 2010 Sell This Version
112 Synthetik 1  album cover Seesselberg Synthetik 1(CDr, Album, Ltd, RE, Unofficial) Creel Pone 112 US 2010 Sell This Version
116 Electronic Tricks  album cover Peter Bonello / Cecil Leuter Peter Bonello / Cecil Leuter - Electronic Tricks(CDr, Album, Ltd, Unofficial) Creel Pone 116 US 2010 Sell This Version

Reviews Show All 31 Reviews

Add Review

Expansive09

Expansive09

November 4, 2018
This label has done archaic electro and electronic music a BENEFIT. Otherwise forgotten audio esoterica would forever be lost. Yes theres little to no money to be made on music that doesnt follow the slave like footsteps of modern popular culture so there are brave soles or as I like to call them audio archiologists whos masters are art in sound who step over the lines of legalities to keep the torch burning for the rest of out curious ears. I think its a disgrace to not allow labels like this to exist considering the some or many of the artists are long deceased and therefore in no "mortal" condition to proliferate their art! Btw I met Keith years ago nice guy who seems genuinely caring about keeping some of the musical oddities in print and that I commend him for.
civilsurface

civilsurface

January 10, 2018
edited 10 months ago
Sadly in a Discogs context it’s all academic now - Creel Pone sales have been blocked on Discogs.

To quote triethylene-glycol below - "Whether what he does is morally acceptable or not is really up to each artist in the series, and I'm sure there is a great array of opinions among them-- I would still bet more are glad for the exposure than are angry at being "robbed" of a few hundred dollars they would never have seen anyway."

Those who’ve seen an official release as a result of interest stimulated by Creel Pone may well be more than happy with Keith’s ‘audacity’ and ‘immorality’. Those who didn’t – well they’ve lost nothing, but at worst have gained some interest in their old material, and will have to wait a bit longer til their reissue (almost inevitably with archive excavation culture as it is) comes along and they get whatever belated credit they’re due. (Probably not financial as there will never be enough sales of this marginalia to make a difference. The oft repeated point about making money is an absurd red herring)

They don’t want their material reissued? Unlikely - it’s more likely they didn’t imagine anyone would be interested. But perhaps enthusiasts now are – after being alerted by Creel Pone. If they really don’t want unavailable material reissued (Desperate Bicycles conceptual-art-twaddle-position springs to mind) perhaps we should say ‘tough luck’. And the bootlegs (not counterfeits) will flow.

If someone really wants to milk their ego in such cases they can choose to sue. Ask the Messthetics guy about that scenario. He took the risk – benefitted numerous musicians, but was hammered by one aggrieved party who sued him for big cash and won. Some may hope Keith receives the same treatment. What would be the point? Apart that is from creaming a wedge of cash you’d never otherwise have received, and ‘teaching that guy a lesson’. Low indeed.

Much like the artists who were happy for Chuck Warner (or the Killed By Death punk series) to 'bootleg' their material only to see demand for official reissues emerge (and the resultant belated recognition), the same will surely apply to CP. Nobody who has had their material released by Creel Pone has lost out in ANY way - except perhaps infuriation at not having got round to reissuing it 1st – so get it together and do it ‘right’ through the subsequent official reissue.

Moral equivalence? There’s a difference between bootlegging (otherwise unavailable material) and counterfeiting (currently available material). Credit where credit’s due – let’s distinguish between clearly different matters. Even if you find both indefensible.

Vertigogardens

Vertigogardens

December 20, 2017
I personally found these issues turned me onto so much music , i just wish i could buy secondhand copies on here of some of creel pone stuff ,anyone want to message me if they have stuff to sell ?
RAB-751

RAB-751

August 29, 2016
I think that label has done a great work making accessible some lost and/or forgotten interesting works for interested persons like me. If any release become available later as official release (for higher price) I will probably buy it as usually the sound is not the same than original release (remixed, remastered,...) and/or includes additional information (new liner notes,...). I don't think this person has do it for the money as the original prices are very correct having in mind the time and work. It's easy for people who have problems with this kind of cdr releases not to buy them...
BrokenMusic

BrokenMusic

March 17, 2015
Hey guys; some great discussion here, but all oddly speculative. If you want answers, just ask - I'll gladly give full disclosure where needed.

The main talking points all appear to involve money; for the most part your calculations are naively oversimplified - "He's 42, he makes $23.8k a year - he has a million dollars !!!" New titles are, these days, generally in editions of 81 - that's three 25-count bundles of print-work w/ a 10% over-run. Of that, about 30-40 copies of each title are given away to the folks that have physically mailed in "Candidate" LPs, or have contributed information & research to the series thus far - the aforementioned "Cabal;" as essential to the program as anyone - or places that have written in asking after "Library Sets," radio stations, etc.

Right now about 10 different shops stock the line, then I end up selling maybe one bundle of each at retail via Mimaroglu over a few months. Massive time-commitment to all of the steps of the process - research, prep, manufacturing, distribution & dispersement. Still burning & printing & assembling each copy one at a time, still doing all of the audio restoration & image-prep myself. You can re-do the math with these new variables plugged in as you see fit, but invariably the dealer from whom I'm buying an original copy of a given title at market value is profiting greater than I will personally from its reproduction.

While I agree that there's no need to have a Creel Pone listing here on Discogs - no more so than having one for virtually everyone's teenage home dub or love-sick mix-tape - I find all of this hate a bit mind-boggling. We're at the point in time where it's completely legal to manufacture a Beatles LP under European copyright & market / distribute it as you see fit - yet here's a fair amount of animosity wrapped up in an extremely humble program to push mostly obscure examples of early, interesting electronic music back into the canon in an extremely modest fashion. The proper reissue rate is about 25%, which I'm extremely happy with - just this month someone wrote asking if it was ok if they used the C.P. master & scans for a reissue of something for which the tapes were long gone - of course I was more than glad to hand everything over. Even the GRM ended up reissuing a piece on one of those "Traces" compilations from their own archives that had been brought to light via the C.P. of the impossible-to-find original LP.

I can only justify Creel Pone's continued existence as I can't wholly condemn it; they get people talking & they turn people on to music that I'm very passionate about. The idea to keep them purely in the physical realm is a personal one; I have no doubts that anyone born 10 years later would do things very differently, but there are myriad places in this world that can be reached by physical objects that the dark corners of the internet will never touch.
steve.delvecchio.56

steve.delvecchio.56

March 15, 2015
Bootlegs do not encourage official releases. (Vinyl reproduction these days is mostly a business model/marketing scam , with the music/art aspect often a distant, secondary consideration in many cases.) If someone wants an original of almost any of the above, they can (as in my situation) pay anywhere from a buck or two to a few hundred dollars. I have made purchases on many of the above at both price extremes, many times.. And still, I have purchased quite a few Creel Pone pirated CD-rs. They are visually quite well done. Sonics are fairly good to excellent sound, in most instances. The tiny repro packaging is very aesthetically pleasing, quite cute and cuddly. (Physical collecting is mostly about fetish anyway.) By creating a marketing niche (bootleg sales), this individual (KFW) is able to partially/mostly? subsidize his distro sales and thereby increase market share in the very competitive, yet dwindling "experimental music" distro business. Yes, his methods amount to just another "business model."
pepsibobert

pepsibobert

February 10, 2015
Everybody else who has rare and long out of print releases in their collection (at least when it comes to avant-garde music) and who is not interested in selling their copies seems to do one of two things:
(1) Keep the releases to themselves, which IMO is clearly the correct decision, or
(2) Upload FREE downloadable links, either at a torrent or their own website, usually via blogspot.

This is the way it has been for years. So what motivation, aside from financial gain, does this person have for putting these releases out in physical form? Clearly it’s not for altruistic reasons. And he gets away with it because it’s not cost-effective for any of the artists or labels to sue for copyright infringement, even though on the surface they would seem to have an open and shut case.

If the artist and/or the label can’t profit from their art, I don’t understand why someone with a fancy record collection and thousands of blank CDRs should either. The assertions at the CP website that these bootlegs are “more expensive to produce than they are sold for”, and that this isn’t done for money, are utterly laughable.
EricLanzillotta

EricLanzillotta

February 2, 2015
Let's do some math here. Even if you use the highest quality CDRs, say Taiyo Uden gold, you are still paying less than 50 cents per disc, probably a lot less when you buy large quantities at once. Inkjet covers are probably less that one dollar even using nice stock and expensive ink. Resealable plastic bags cost very little, around 5 cents each. Keith has been selling these discs for $10 each. Originally they were claimed to be editions of 50. Then editions of 100. Now no edition size is mentioned and early "sold out" titles have been reappearing on his site. So he is probably making more than 100 of some titles. If a title gets yanked because it gets an official release or a complaint from the artist, the discs are removed from the site, but still sold. I have seen a record store get re-stocked on several long deleted titles. The highest catalog number on the Mimaroglu site right now is CP 176. A handful of titles were double discs and one was triple. Say we round down to 150 titles for the sake of argument and that he really does only sell 50 copies of each. That is $75,000 retail. Even with a liberal cost of $2 per unit, that clears $60,000. If we think he sold 100 of each instead of 50, that brings it to around $120,000 profit. Of course copies are sold wholesale for around $6 to $7.50, but I haven't seen many other people offering these titles and I think I more than compensate that by figuring only 150 single disc titles instead of 176. (Even if you did count only 150 titles selling 50 copies at $6 each, that is still $45,000.) And again that is not taking into account there they may be more than 100 copies of some titles, which makes sense considering that he stopped stating an edition size. This is very far from operating at a loss or break even point. This is making an awful lot of money from screwing over obscure artists. Some of them are indeed hard to track down, but there are plenty that aren't. I don't buy into the idea that these bootlegs encourage official reissues, but believe that it probably harms them more as it means less of an official reissue will sell, and artists and label will think that there is no room for an official issue if someone is already selling a bootlegged version. Other than Keith's bank account, I don't think this label is to anyone's advantage.
ttooyyss

ttooyyss

July 26, 2013
edited over 5 years ago
I'm a CD-writer/writing audio engineer! So I know what is CD-writing is about technically. First of all: there's only a hadful of people who can burn quality CD-Rs. Then: Many of the CD-R material is very unreliable and will not stand the time and the pits/lands will simply corrodate and the music will get lost within a time. I've tested many CD-R materials and even I have hounderds of CD-rs which can't be read anymore after a few years. So please look out! The music will be lost, unless it's written onto some REAL and not fake high-end CD-Rs as Verbatim Metal AZO for example. Last don't least: the writing method counts a lot. A 4x speed written CD-r will bring you terrible sonic distortions while auditioning it in real-time!!!!
plunderpunk

plunderpunk

May 15, 2012
edited over 6 years ago
ALL micro labels operate at either a loss or just break even.